Avian Flu

[4pygmies]

I live right on the edge of the exclusion zone and there are red warning signs going up everywhere...makes you realise quite how many battery farms there are.......and still the news is full of stuff about wild birds spreading the disease when there is NO established link at all. It makes me cross....if you repeat something often enough it doesn't make it true!

And I wonder how many people will spare a thought for all the poor creatures who lived in misery in these battery farms destined to be killed and eaten who have now been 'destroyed'...sometimes it seems as if the only real worry is whether there will be enough available for people to stuff themselves with at Christmas. How terrible for everyone if they have to fill their already crammed table with something other than turkey, goose or duck....we seem to have a very odd set of priorities in this country.

[debbiem]

Isn't it heartbreaking? The whole thing's dreadful all round - I know of people who keep a few chickens who have been almost witchhunted by their neighbours when this rears its head. Panic stations everywhere and no point to any of it whatsoever.

And you're right - every time they've been talking about it on the news they 'reassure' everyone that if your turkey's cooked right your at no risk at all......oh well that's OK then. Next minute they're showing hundreds of turkeys being thrown into some kind of gas oven - awful.

[roan]

Heard about it on the news yesterday and wondered if you were anywhere near 4 pygmies as you live in Norfolk. It must be a big worry in case it spreads. Do you have any chickens etc.?

[4pygmies]

I have kept chickens for years Roan, although I have only one very elderly old lady left. She is a free ranger, has laid beautiful eggs for me for years and has always been very healthy and fit. I remain convinced that birds who are allowed to forage naturally for food, who live with the minimum of interference and who treated with respect and understanding of their needs will build up a natural immunity to many of the diseases and conditions which beset their less fortunate battery counterparts. So while I am concerned about her general health I don't think she will fall victim to this particular strain of virus. As a matter of fact, Blue Tongue, which is now in this country and is very dangerous for sheeps and goats etc is much more of a worry to me as this is a disease spread by mosquitos. It doesn't seem to be as much in the news as Avian flu since it is not as important as whether the nation gets its Christmas bird (she said sarcastically...) but which, potentially, I think is a much more serious threat to livestock.
I still believe the root of the problem with all these horrendous diseases is the barbaric and cruel way we feed and house our farm animals. We have been heading for disaster for years.....all the vile things we feed them and all the toxic chemicals we inject them with, it's all coming back to haunt us. Cheerful aren't I? ;D

[roan]

You are so right, we do keep animals and birds in inhuman conditions and fill them full of chemicals.

In NZ most animals are kept outside and feed off the grasses in the paddocks, although they do get supplements which are a bit of a worry.

Turkeys run wild here, it is not unusual to see a large flock of them on the side of the road, perhaps 30 to 50 birds. Some people do eat them, but they are pretty tough!

Fortunately we do have farmers who farm organically and their vegetables and meat are very superior in taste and quality - funny that!

Haven't heard much about Blue Tongue. I do hope your goats are never affected. By the way do have goats milk, or make cheese perhaps?

[4pygmies]

My goats are a motley selection of mainly pygmy, Roan! They can be milked but I don't want any more kids so none of mine will ever be in milk. I longed for dairy goats for many years but I don't have the time or energy these days. I have made goats cheese from friends goats in the past but, if I'm brutally honest, it wasn't very edible! I do love fresh goats milk though and would love to be able to pop out & pull myself a pint or two ;D Ah well....never mind!

[bogmyrtle]

4pygmies, I agree with you, we mess with nature without a thought to the consequences that could be ahead.

Unfortunately sometimes the truth isn't enough in some people's eyes, exaggeration/distortion of the facts causes a 'shock/wow' factor. It grabs their attention.

[madonplants]

Bird 'flu does exist in wild birds, quite often the migratory ones. As a fisherman, we are told to look out for dead swans, ducks etc. and notify the authorities if we see more than one dead in the same place.
Just to what extent the problem is, do the experts really know yet?

Keith

[4pygmies]

I know that there is Avian flu strains present in the wild bird population Keith but there is no evidence that they are responsible for passing it to our farmed bird stocks. I still maintain that wild birds will build up a natural immunity to this disease unlike our battery birds who have had their immune systems completely compromised by a constant diet of chemicals and unnatural food. I simply can't understand why farms are allowed to continue to do this when there are these constant threats and problems. We are doing immense damage to ourselves and the animals we depend upon for food. Not very sensible IMO.

[madonplants]

4pygmies said:

I know that there is Avian flu strains present in the wild bird population Keith but there is no evidence that they are responsible for passing it to our farmed bird stocks. I still maintain that wild birds will build up a natural immunity to this disease unlike our battery birds who have had their immune systems completely compromised by a constant diet of chemicals and unnatural food. I simply can't understand why farms are allowed to continue to do this when there are these constant threats and problems. We are doing immense damage to ourselves and the animals we depend upon for food. Not very sensible IMO.

I totally agree with you there. After I posted earlier, I had a quick google, well Yahoo anyway, and its surprising what info is out there for and against. I think it was the BBC site that mentioned Chicken poo manure, for something, can't remember what. Defra had some good info regarding the whole problem, quite interesting.
I am going to watch this space.

Keith

P.s. Just found that page again, it was fish farms!

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4642008.stm

[4pygmies]

There are some very interesting articles about avian flu in the Country Smallholding magazine if you're interested, particularly Alan Beat's article 'A trade in Disease'.

www.countrysmallholding.com/

[madonplants]

4pygmies said:

There are some very interesting articles about avian flu in the Country Smallholding magazine if you're interested, particularly Alan Beat's article 'A trade in Disease'.

www.countrysmallholding.com/

That's a huge article, I'll read it later, thanks.

Keith

[Sweetleaf]

It seems clear that intensive Commercial Chicken farms are the culprit and that small flocks are being victimised while the big factory farms are allowed to continue their trade almost unhampered

[4pygmies]

sweetleaf2 said:

It seems clear that intensive Commercial Chicken farms are the culprit and that small flocks are being victimised while the big factory farms are allowed to continue their trade almost unhampered

Consumers have the power the stop all this but very few exercise their right to choose. If more people ate less meat but of better quality and with ethical considerations to the fore, it would very soon alter the way we farm. I'm so sorry if I sound really preachy and OTT but I feel strongly about it! Organic or Free Range meat is considered expensive but, in fact, it more closely reflects the true costs of rearing animals and treating them properly, that's all. Sadly more people seem to worry about 'bargain' price chickens from supermarkets without a care about the terrible cruelty involved in the poor creatures short and barbaric lives. It makes me laugh when we are described as a nation of anmal lovers - a lot less pampered pooches and a more natural life for our food animals would be a start......

[Sleepy]

The said:

Most consumers just don't have a clue though, which is the crux of the problem IMO.

It's hardly rocket science to understand that free range means the animals have a better quality of life. Or that organic means they have a far better and healthier diet.

The trouble is it is a fact that half the people in this country are of below average intelligence.