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Post by 4pygmies on Jul 2, 2008 16:02:22 GMT 1
Thank you, Petal. And you're right, the children really loved it but I couldn't garden with more than a fraction of those interested because I didn't have enough adult helpers...it's such a crying shame. I still think gardening should be part of the National Curriculum - may be then the teachers would have got more involved.
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Post by madonplants on Jul 2, 2008 16:48:57 GMT 1
Thank you, Petal. And you're right, the children really loved it but I couldn't garden with more than a fraction of those interested because I didn't have enough adult helpers...it's such a crying shame. I still think gardening should be part of the National Curriculum - may be then the teachers would have got more involved. It's a shame, but could never see that happen, schools are more interested in teaching them about computers or (in Stephen's case) how to speak Spanish(  ), etc. Craig, like most of his friends, absolutely hates P.A. at school, though I have said, there maybe a budding actor or actress in his class that wouldn't be found, if they didn't have that lesson. Like I have said before, Craig felt uncool telling his friends he liked Springwatch, until one of his friends told him he loves watching it as well. Most have interests around what's the next Playstation game or what mobile phone have you got, etc. I think it would be a shame if you had to give it up, 4P, but you come first. If you aren't getting 'anything' out of it, stop doing it! Maybe once you give up, they will realise what they have lost. Don't forget the school got the greenhouse, pond and the camera nesting box, so there must be some interest there, just not the practical kind, which is the hardest bit, as you know. Just remember that girl that wanted to be a gardener when she grows up, that was because of YOU! I became interested in gardening, because my dad was a gardener by trade and my mum was interested in what birds came into the garden, so I had a good foundation into wildlife/gardening from an ealry age, a lot of kids don't have that nowadays, sadly. What's the disapointing thing is, those parents would come if they knew they were going to get paid for it. I have helped out at some of the boy's schools, but as you know at Stephen's school, I'm not their favourite person atm, am I?  |
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Post by Sleepy on Jul 2, 2008 16:56:30 GMT 1
Thank you, Petal. And you're right, the children really loved it but I couldn't garden with more than a fraction of those interested because I didn't have enough adult helpers...it's such a crying shame. I still think gardening should be part of the National Curriculum - may be then the teachers would have got more involved. It's a shame, but could never see that happen, schools are more interested in teaching them about computers or (in Stephen's case) how to speak Spanish( ), etc. Craig, like most of his friends, absolutely hates P.A. at school, though I have said, there maybe a budding actor or actress in his class that wouldn't be found, if they didn't have that lesson. Like I have said before, Craig felt uncool telling his friends he liked Springwatch, until one of his friends told him he loves watching it as well. Most have interests around what's the next Playstation game or what mobile phone have you got, etc. I think it would be a shame if you had to give it up, 4P, but you come first. If you aren't getting 'anything' out of it, stop doing it! Maybe once you give up, they will realise what they have lost. Don't forget the school got the greenhouse, pond and the camera nesting box, so there must be some interest there, just not the practical kind, which is the hardest bit, as you know. Just remember that girl that wanted to be a gardener when she grows up, that was because of YOU! I became interested in gardening, because my dad was a gardener by trade and my mum was interested in what birds came into the garden, so I had a good foundation into wildlife/gardening from an ealry age, a lot of kids don't have that nowadays, sadly. What's the disapointing thing is, those parents would come if they knew they were going to get paid for it. I have helped out at some of the boy's schools, but as you know at Stephen's school, I'm not their favourite person atm, am I? I agree with Keith. One success makes everything worth while, no matter how apathetic the rest all are. Introducing a love of gardening to one child is a precious and immeasurably valuable thing to have done. But put yourself first - you have other areas in your life that you may consider to be worthy of the attention insead. |
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Post by cheerypeabrain on Jul 2, 2008 17:07:38 GMT 1
I think that you've done your bit 4P. If littleun was happy at the school maybe you'd have wanted to stay on...but just for once, think of your own needs.
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Post by cheerypeabrain on Jul 2, 2008 19:37:29 GMT 1
I think that you've done your bit 4P. If littleun was happy at the school maybe you'd have wanted to stay on...but just for once, think of your own needs. I should add that, you've already dedicated a lot of time, energy and personal expense on this project, it's time for the school governors to take it over...lets face it...they were quite happy to step in and take over when the you managed to get the grant for them... You haven't got the time now meduck. You're too busy. |
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Post by 4pygmies on Jul 3, 2008 7:09:54 GMT 1
So what you mean is: another magnificant failure...  Ah well, thanks anyway angel cakes..... I had a satisfying dream last night - standing in the playground shouting at all the Stepford Wives and lambasting them for their smugness, short sighted obsession with peripheral nonsense and silliness, and selfish avoidance of doing anything that matters with their children.......horrid, aren't I? It was fun though...I kept going over my speech perfecting it until I had got just about every frustration I'd ever felt into it - it was a polished gem of poisonous invective and egotistical ranting, though I say it myself - good job I'm NOT Empress of the World isn't it?? Besides, I know that they all love their children passionately and are all doing the best they can, like we all are. It's just that they have no vision.......  |
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Post by debbiem on Jul 3, 2008 10:22:35 GMT 1
I know all about the apathy of other parents, you must be so frustrated and disappointed with people 4P! I can never get over sending out party invitations for one of my children's parties and people never bothering to reply, and the main offenders aren't the thick and rude and stupid but usually the ones so up themselves that it makes my toes curl!
But just a thought, maybe to see things from the point of view of the apathetic at your school....
How well do you know the other mums 4P? It's just that I live in a so-called community full of miserable old sods, some nice people yes but lots of little pockets of people where this lot will talk to that lot but stab that other lot in the back etc. There are loads of places that ask for volunteers for all kinds of things which I would willingly do but if any of these cliquey people who blank me in the street(hardly any nowadays thankfully but still some) have anything to do with it NO CHANCE and there's always that chance you'll be stuck in a situation with them, my scenario is me coming in all willing to help and getting a load of snottiness and attitude for my efforts. I should imagine it puts a lot of people off. So there's you just wanting some enthusiasm and interest and participation which isn't a lot to ask but there's all these reservations going on within these parents and they don't know if so-and-so's Mum is going to be there etc.
If somebody actually asked me to my face I'd then be in no doubt that I was really needed and I could override those kind of reservations. It's the same with the school - they have all kinds of support from me except when they want my physical presence at meetings etc where you'll be amongst people who are going to wind you up and it'll be a bad experience.......again if I KNEW that the school desperately needed help I'd be there but I've always steered clear because of the 'unknown' and how badly do they want my help anyway?.......
Are you sure the parents aren't thinking like this? That this lot don't like that lot or don't want the community thing as they might be thrown socially into a situation they don't want, with committments?
Once bitten they say - well I've been gnawed all over! I would love to help as it's the way I am but something is always stopping me - I don't know what I'll be letting myself in for.
Is there any chance they might be thinking along those lines and need a few myths dispelling?
I support the school in every other way and come to almost all the kids' events and shows but coming in to help.....eek.
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Post by madonplants on Jul 3, 2008 10:45:34 GMT 1
It's the work I think. When we lived in Corby (don't live in Corby!) Craig's primary school wanted help with a new wildlife area. I was there and actually advised the normal gardener of the school, what to do. I really enjoyed myself, but most of the women that turned up, just used it as a social event and used the day we were there, to talk to the others. Yet there were plenty of spades on hand, brought in by the so called professionals. I am hoping that wasn't a sexist comment, as some did do some digging. When it was time to go home, we were all told, if they needed any more help they would contact us for another session. They said the normal gardener would keep up with things afterwards. Noone was ever contacted and the wildlife area got neglected. I mean, the water wasn't even kept topped up in the little pond we built and it ended up empty!! I felt upset with all the hard work some of us had done and wondered whether the school had done it, just to get some parents talking to each other! I was going to challenge the school about it, but we soon moved, so decided against saying anything, for risk of stepping on the normal gardener's toes, so to speak. Maybe I should have done, but that's not me is it?  |
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Post by debbiem on Jul 3, 2008 11:02:08 GMT 1
It's crossed my mind too about being raked in to get the parents speaking to each other Keith - my youngest is in loads of little shows atm and there was one this morning for 25min! I don't have the car today so I asked her if she'd mind me missing this one, which she didn't as I've got the 2 hour fete tomorrow there anyway. It has occurred to me whether all the kids are involved in as much as possible to blackmail the parents to come into the school time after time after time again which looks good for Ofsted, as our school was recommended by Ofsted to have more communication with the parents......! With 3 kids at the school I'm getting dizzy!
For all you know it was the yakking parents that put the mockers on being asked to help again - the gardener saw all these bods standing around with only a handful of parents pitching in. That would have annoyed me too.
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Post by madonplants on Jul 3, 2008 11:36:07 GMT 1
It's crossed my mind too about being raked in to get the parents speaking to each other Keith - my youngest is in loads of little shows atm and there was one this morning for 25min! I don't have the car today so I asked her if she'd mind me missing this one, which she didn't as I've got the 2 hour fete tomorrow there anyway. It has occurred to me whether all the kids are involved in as much as possible to blackmail the parents to come into the school time after time after time again which looks good for Ofsted, as our school was recommended by Ofsted to have more communication with the parents......! With 3 kids at the school I'm getting dizzy! For all you know it was the yakking parents that put the mockers on being asked to help again - the gardener saw all these bods standing around with only a handful of parents pitching in. That would have annoyed me too. I never thought of that, good point. But they knew who I was, as Craig had come with me (it was a Saturday) so why didn't they talk discreetly to a few of us. I tell you something as well, he did more work that about 5/6 of them put together and he was only about 5 at the time. One of the women was really quite good, she sort of followed me around, as she wanted advice for her own garden. It was us two, who got stuck into the pond, it was only a small one, but I am sure it would have been OK. We had used rocks we had dug up from the plot, for the surround and had a reasonably good liner, laid on some sand. We then got stuck into a path, that the 'professional' was doing and I still remember the posts needed cutting flush with the boards and no one had a saw. Out came my Swiss Army knife's saw and actually was quite impressed, along with others, how well it did the job. It was around about this time, the gardener's colleague, came to help out and she was impressed with how well some of us had done. She also brought a saw, so she finished off some of the ones I had still to do. My little saw was OK, but nothing compared to the real thing!! All in all, it was a good day out, that sadly couldn't be repeated. Btw, Jennifer was well pregnant with Stephen to help, just in case anyone asks!! |
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Post by 4pygmies on Jul 3, 2008 13:56:12 GMT 1
I have tried to see it from other's points of view but, the bottom line, is that they have been cajoled, pleaded with, told that events will be cancelled if no one offers to help, they've been sent newsletters, had posters on the school noticeboard, etc etc but still they all turn a blind eye. They simply aren't interested.
They've seen me standing at tables trying to sell plants the children have grown, actually working with the children out on the playground as they come pick up theirs, giving away seeds and plants with pots in, building the dipping ponds (and seen the two builders spending a week putting up the greenhouse last year), over the last 3 years - and still no one enquires, looks interested or even has a look around when their kids want to show them.......schools ALWAYS need parents support - at meetings, after school activities, fund raising events, in class and on school trips. I have been involved at that school since my children attended there 15 years ago, I've been through the pre school group and helped at the village events in that time too..it's always the same few faces who turn up religiously to give their time (and money).
The village's Fun Day was cancelled last month because of the lack of volunteers to run it, the Firework Display is threatened because of the lack of interest - and this is a fairly large village I'm talking about, with 3 massive estates and a thriving village store, a post office and a newsagents as well as a pub/ hotel.....you can try to find a reason but I think it's fairly straightforward.......and it sincerely makes me despair at how vaccuous and shallow they all are.... That might make me sound very judgmental and harsh but, tbh, I think it's the truth!
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Post by cheerypeabrain on Jul 3, 2008 19:49:05 GMT 1
So what you mean is: another magnificant failure... Ah well, thanks anyway angel cakes..... I had a satisfying dream last night - standing in the playground shouting at all the Stepford Wives and lambasting them for their smugness, short sighted obsession with peripheral nonsense and silliness, and selfish avoidance of doing anything that matters with their children.......horrid, aren't I? It was fun though...I kept going over my speech perfecting it until I had got just about every frustration I'd ever felt into it - it was a polished gem of poisonous invective and egotistical ranting, though I say it myself - good job I'm NOT Empress of the World isn't it?? Besides, I know that they all love their children passionately and are all doing the best they can, like we all are. It's just that they have no vision....... it was NOT a failure! You did a fantastic job and sparked the enthusiasm and interest of the whole school! People will always be happy to sit back and let somebody else do all the work, it's human nature! I wanted to be involved in my sons' school, but there was already a group of Mums and Dads who were very close friends and they wouldn't admit an outsider..it was VERY frustrating! I was allowed to sell raffle tickets...that's about it. They organised coffee mornings (to which I was never invited) and stalls at the school fete (I could donate stuff, but couldn't run a stall because they didn't need me) They were v nice people...but didn't want common folk like me on their PTA...this included the local Vicar and his wife, a journalist on the local paper. a local councilor and some ex-teachers who had given up work to look after their children. Nobody on the PTA lived in a council house (altho plenty of the pupils did) and they were all posh. I'm sure that they did their very best for the school...but even when one of them left the rest of them voted on her replacement (nother of their cronies)...none of us other Mums and Dads stood a chance... I wouldn't have minded if it was a particularly good school...which it wasn't. ENOUGH...what I mean is...you have done a brilliant job. If you leave now, eventually somebody will take over, another Mum, Dad or teacher will think 'Wouldn't it be lovely to grow plants with the children....' You have moved on with your life and no longer have the free time needed to dedicate to the club, there's nothing wrong with that, you can't be in two places at once! Be proud of your achievments 4P, we already are.  |
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Post by floweringcherry on Jul 3, 2008 22:52:40 GMT 1
4P, I so know where you are coming from. When my kids were at primary school, I went to the first meeting of the PTA, very few parents there, I had my eldest just started and 2 younger children ( I had 3 children in 3 years 4 months) I said I was quite happy to help out and did the Xmas Fayres, Summer Fetes always on the plant stalls in the summer, supplying lots of plants. My friend over the road had one child and was on the comittee and did great things.
I was limited with the 3 young children but did what I could.
As you say, the same faces doing things and in a minority. By the time they got to secondary school, I admit, hands up I took a step back. I was working full time, just coping with home and work was more than enough!
I really admire what you have achieved, but if with your other jobs and responsibilities it is time to move on, you must do so. In this world, no-one thinks about you, but you. Do what you feel is right for you and you have nothing to feel guilty about.
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Post by 4pygmies on Jul 4, 2008 7:10:03 GMT 1
Thanks FC. Obviously I don't mean any of the above as a criticism of anyone here! Working and bringing a family is enough of a struggle isn't it? I wouldn't mind if it was that as a reason - that's fair enough. But so many of the women stand about gossiping for hours around the village, kids hanging off their arms getting bored...and so few of the teachers have shown more than a passing, cursory interest. I find that extremely frustrating. I just do NOT understand how they can sit in their classsrooms teaching science, maths, biology etc without recourse to the wonderful resources outside! I very strongly believe that if children's interest is engaged that they will soak up knowledge - and what child wouldn't be interested in dipping in ponds, looking at insects through a magnifying glass, conducting surveys about plant life etc whilst sitting in the sunshine in a wild life garden??  It's a very strange and un-teacherly attitude to me.....and a microcosm of what is wrong with the education system atm. I have been in the staffroom on many occasions trying to get the teachers to use the things we have set up and they are all agreed that it would be lovely to do outdoor stuff but they don't have time! What? What is so hard about gathering up your students and stepping out of the door? They all do it for PE sessions......what they really mean is, it's much easier to keep up with their National Curriculum requirements using worksheets and whiteboards! A more holistic approach would keep the children interested and make their work easier IMO but what do I know? I'm just a parent, I've just been in schools for the past 25 or so years and I don't get paid a fortune to train pupils to pass poxy SATS exams and keep the OFSTED inspectors happy...... Sorry! Going on again................................................. |
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Post by madonplants on Jul 4, 2008 10:30:30 GMT 1
Thanks FC. Obviously I don't mean any of the above as a criticism of anyone here! Working and bringing a family is enough of a struggle isn't it? I wouldn't mind if it was that as a reason - that's fair enough. But so many of the women stand about gossiping for hours around the village, kids hanging off their arms getting bored...and so few of the teachers have shown more than a passing, cursory interest. I find that extremely frustrating. I just do NOT understand how they can sit in their classsrooms teaching science, maths, biology etc without recourse to the wonderful resources outside! I very strongly believe that if children's interest is engaged that they will soak up knowledge - and what child wouldn't be interested in dipping in ponds, looking at insects through a magnifying glass, conducting surveys about plant life etc whilst sitting in the sunshine in a wild life garden?? It's a very strange and un-teacherly attitude to me.....and a microcosm of what is wrong with the education system atm. I have been in the staffroom on many occasions trying to get the teachers to use the things we have set up and they are all agreed that it would be lovely to do outdoor stuff but they don't have time! What? What is so hard about gathering up your students and stepping out of the door? They all do it for PE sessions......what they really mean is, it's much easier to keep up with their National Curriculum requirements using worksheets and whiteboards! A more holistic approach would keep the children interested and make their work easier IMO but what do I know? I'm just a parent, I've just been in schools for the past 25 or so years and I don't get paid a fortune to train pupils to pass poxy SATS exams and keep the OFSTED inspectors happy...... Sorry! Going on again................................................. They can't do that, they might get sunburnt, 4P! Come on, you should know, schools don't allow you to get sunburnt nowadays. God forbid!! ;D Craig has recently been shoved in front of videos at school, 'cos it's nearly the end of term, they say. What, they have two weeks to go yet!!  No wonder he doesn't want as much time on his XBox recently, he'd rather go to the park and play football with his friends.  You rant as much as you like, we don't mind, your talking to the educated here. |
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Post by 4pygmies on Jul 4, 2008 10:37:31 GMT 1
I know!  |
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Post by 4pygmies on Jul 16, 2008 15:54:53 GMT 1
It was my very last Gardening Club session at the school today  I felt really quite treacherous...as, as ever, lots of kids wanted to join in.... We harvested our potatoes, much to the childrens excitment. We grew them in old compost bags and they did pretty well. We filled two seed trays up to the brims and so they each took enough home for a meal. It was lovely to see their glee when we divvied them out. Several of them were saying about how amazed their parents would be that they'd grown the spuds themselves - I find that quite touching - if ONLY their parents would do stuff at home...sigh.........we had a good chat about what they could try at home so maybe it will happen for some of them. In 3/4 of an hour we touched on botany, biology, mathematics, the weather and why plants need sunshine. We discussed the need for water, how the soil affected what we'd grown, which plants were seen as weeds and why, and why we put stuff in the compost bin. We talked about the need for hygiene, how the potatoes could be cooked and what food would go with them. We also worked as a group, talked about listening to instructions and not interrupting. Then we discussed how much water a watering can could hold and why the ponds needed filling up. We looked at insects in the wildlife tower and on the suface of the pond. We smelt the wild flowers and looked at their beautiful patterns, both leaf and flower, and we were extremely happy all that time, and we covered a fair number of topics as you can see ;D Why can't the teachers see what a wonderful resource they have right outside their classroom?  There was some discussion also about how they could carry on next year - so I unashamedly told them to nag and nag and try and MAKE some parents get involved. ;D We finished up having a poke about the dipping ponds, which was fun too. They had a fine time pulling out the nasty weed with sticks. In the corridor afterwards the Infant teacher stopped me to tell me about some new rule from on high - apparently schools are not allowed to grow cherries or potatoes now........as the foliage is poisonous! We had a very satisfying grump about it too....isn't it ridiculous? These POXY idiots making idiotic rules need to get a life! (Growing vegetables might be a good start............) Anyway, that's that! I feel really sad actually................ But the Parent Support Advisor who has been coming along was very enthusiastic about my new job at Ecotech. She has changed jobs too and is now working to get more community stuff done in schools - like gardening clubs! She was very keen to get in touch with the Garden Science Trust, my new employers, to see if she could get some school groups there - so I might not have totally wasted my time at the school! If she could arrange for some Primary Schools to work with us at Ecotech.........wouldn't that be a fine thing?? That's the last time I shall go on and on about it now! ;D : |
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Post by Sleepy on Jul 16, 2008 16:01:10 GMT 1
That would be a brilliant thing. And I am sure that you efforts with gardening Club will have inspired future gardeners. You have sow seeds - little human seeds |
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Post by emseypop on Jul 16, 2008 16:20:39 GMT 1
Its the end of an era 4P but the begging of a new one. You've touched the lives of the little gardening club members and sown more than veg and flowers! It looks like your good work will live on one way or another at the school. Off to pastures new, I'll miss this thread but looking forward to the new one your sure too make! ;D  |
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Post by madonplants on Jul 16, 2008 17:01:29 GMT 1
You did all that in 45 minutes, what were you teaching them before!!  Can't grow cherries or spuds, cos the foliage is poisoness, that is ludicrous!! Children NEED TO BE TAUGHT these things, not avoid them! Like Ems has said, going to miss this thread. A big well done to you 4P, for what you have done, you should feel very proud of yourself, as we do. |
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Post by debbiem on Jul 17, 2008 9:33:30 GMT 1
Hear hear Keith! And I have an inkling that the Gardening Club kids will remember their time in the Gardening Club in years to come when they look back on their schooldays, far more than they'll ever remember anything done indoors. |
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Post by 4pygmies on Jul 17, 2008 12:53:26 GMT 1
Hear hear Keith! And I have an inkling that the Gardening Club kids will remember their time in the Gardening Club in years to come when they look back on their schooldays, far more than they'll ever remember anything done indoors. Wouldn't that be a lovely thing? I really hope they do..... Can I just say how much I have appreciated all the interest and support you lovely things have given me since I started Gardening Club? I know I've been very OTT and extremely low on many occasions but it's only because it was so important to me that it was a success. Your comments have kept me going on more than one occasion - thanks very much - you are all brilliant! And, no doubt, I shall have another thread about my new job.....can't really shut me up actually............ ;D |
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Post by madonplants on Jul 17, 2008 14:34:23 GMT 1
Hear hear Keith! And I have an inkling that the Gardening Club kids will remember their time in the Gardening Club in years to come when they look back on their schooldays, far more than they'll ever remember anything done indoors. Wouldn't that be a lovely thing? I really hope they do..... Can I just say how much I have appreciated all the interest and support you lovely things have given me since I started Gardening Club? I know I've been very OTT and extremely low on many occasions but it's only because it was so important to me that it was a success. Your comments have kept me going on more than one occasion - thanks very much - you are all brilliant! And, no doubt, I shall have another thread about my new job.....can't really shut me up actually............ ;D Did you take any last pictures, 4P? |
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Post by 4pygmies on Jul 17, 2008 15:18:20 GMT 1
Nope......couldn't bear too...sorry......... We are visiting the new school tomorrow....can't wait to see what sort of garden they have.... |
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Post by emseypop on Jul 17, 2008 16:26:05 GMT 1
me nither Keep us posted! OHH I hope this will be the break Rosie needs to make school a more positive place! I remember that gut churning, sinking feeling that used to hit home every Sunday evening I cant bear the theme tune to open all hours always takes me back. |
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), etc. Craig, like most of his friends, absolutely hates P.A. at school, though I have said, there maybe a budding actor or actress in his class that wouldn't be found, if they didn't have that lesson. 
No wonder he doesn't want as much time on his XBox recently, he'd rather go to the park and play football with his friends. 
I felt really quite treacherous...as, as ever, lots of kids wanted to join in.... We harvested our potatoes, much to the childrens excitment. We grew them in old compost bags and they did pretty well. We filled two seed trays up to the brims and so they each took enough home for a meal. It was lovely to see their glee when we divvied them out. Several of them were saying about how amazed their parents would be that they'd grown the spuds themselves - I find that quite touching - if ONLY their parents would do stuff at home...sigh.........we had a good chat about what they could try at home so maybe it will happen for some of them. 
